Corona

[Geoff]

1 hour ago, Glen said:

wrong. I only use the term misinformation when it is warranted

perfectly happy to listen to other people's opinions and change my mind.

in this case though squawking about vaccines not working is spewing misinformation. 

On the flip side, you call anyone who disagrees with you a liberal and end your debate in the same way

 

The problem seems to be that through yours and like minded eyes, misinformation only comes from those who do not agree with you. 

Have you ever acknowledged the misinformation that our political leaders, "health experts" and media have fed us on a constant drip feed over the last few years? Isn't that the type of misinformation we should be most concerned about, considering it's what whipped up this whole maniacal frenzy? 

[Glen]

3 hours ago, Geoff said:

The problem seems to be that through yours and like minded eyes, misinformation only comes from those who do not agree with you. 

Have you ever acknowledged the misinformation that our political leaders, "health experts" and media have fed us on a constant drip feed over the last few years? Isn't that the type of misinformation we should be most concerned about, considering it's what whipped up this whole maniacal frenzy? 

not true as I said above.

Quite happy to debate differing opinions but not on whether vaccines work or not. 

Especially when the evidence is plain to see

Also, your opinion on what constitutes a maniacal frenzy is different to most logical people 

[Geoff]

20 minutes ago, Glen said:

not true as I said above.

Quite happy to debate differing opinions but not on whether vaccines work or not. 

Especially when the evidence is plain to see

Also, your opinion on what constitutes a maniacal frenzy is different to most logical people 

It depends on what your definition of "work" is. How exactly does a covid vaccine work on a child? Or young adult? Or a 30 year old? 40 year old? Anyone healthy and under 65?  

Never disputed that the vaccine is worthwhile for "vulnerable" age groups and those with existing medical conditions. But one size does not fit all. 

I'm glad the UK were able to hold their nerve with the thousands of deaths a day you speak of and everyone remained calm, logical and sensible. I can assure you with a horrid, clear recollection that a maniacal frenzy is what covid was treated with in Australia. I will never get the daily press conferences reporting sometimes one or two cases out of my head... every day for about two years. 

[Glen]

1 hour ago, Geoff said:

It depends on what your definition of "work" is. How exactly does a covid vaccine work on a child? Or young adult? Or a 30 year old? 40 year old? Anyone healthy and under 65?  

Never disputed that the vaccine is worthwhile for "vulnerable" age groups and those with existing medical conditions. But one size does not fit all. 

I'm glad the UK were able to hold their nerve with the thousands of deaths a day you speak of and everyone remained calm, logical and sensible. I can assure you with a horrid, clear recollection that a maniacal frenzy is what covid was treated with in Australia. I will never get the daily press conferences reporting sometimes one or two cases out of my head... every day for about two years. 

You could ask that about any vaccine.

I assume your children have received several.

Not I'm condoning a covid vaccine for children.

but in the early days plenty of healthy under 65s died who would no doubt have given anything to have previously had the luxury of a covid jab, as they drew their last breath 

[Glen]

as of Nov 21 (which is a while ago) :

20,000 under the age of 65 have died of COVID in UK

50% had no underlying health conditions.

 

[auslander]

Geoff, you will want to read this. An article on ABC strangely enough! 

Report into COVID-19 response asserts 'mistakes were made' - ABC News https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-10-20/covid-review-finds-vulnerable-people-disadvantaged-by-response/101554960

 

[Geoff]

4 hours ago, auslander said:

Geoff, you will want to read this. An article on ABC strangely enough! 

Report into COVID-19 response asserts 'mistakes were made' - ABC News https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-10-20/covid-review-finds-vulnerable-people-disadvantaged-by-response/101554960

 

Interesting surface scratching article. I think it’s clear to most that if genuine investigations are done into what was allowed to happen in the last few years, that any and every single conclusion would be scathing. 
 

I remain convinced that no one will ever be held accountable, though. 
 

Not sure you see any of this stuff about excess mortalities since the pandemic. If I’m not mistaken, Australia is trending very high on these lists. What a shock this must be, that falling into a hysterical panic over what is essentially a new strain of the flu, at the expense of every single other thing in the country, could yield unfavourable results. Never could have foreseen such a thing. 

[Glen]

On 10/18/2022 at 4:09 PM, Glen said:

as of Nov 21 (which is a while ago) :

20,000 under the age of 65 have died of COVID in UK

50% had no underlying health conditions.

 

no response to this then Geoff? 

Probably because you can't argue with it and it impacts your blinkered viewpoint. 

I'm pretty sure that stat is probably higher than any other death cause as in 2017 for example the leading cause of death for males age 30-50 was accidental poisoning (!) followed by suicide.

As I've previously mentioned on numerous occasions (mostly ignored), the death rate in UK hit nearly 2000 a day from covid. These were excess deaths as proven by excess mortality stats. That's more from one cause than the normal daily death of around 1500 for every case.

So in my opinion our response was measured and I will not criticise it. 

This might not have happened in Australia but it happened in UK. 

But this will fall on deaf ears so I might as well move on. 

 

 

[Geoff]

3 hours ago, Glen said:

no response to this then Geoff? 

Probably because you can't argue with it and it impacts your blinkered viewpoint. 

I'm pretty sure that stat is probably higher than any other death cause as in 2017 for example the leading cause of death for males age 30-50 was accidental poisoning (!) followed by suicide.

As I've previously mentioned on numerous occasions (mostly ignored), the death rate in UK hit nearly 2000 a day from covid. These were excess deaths as proven by excess mortality stats. That's more from one cause than the normal daily death of around 1500 for every case.

So in my opinion our response was measured and I will not criticise it. 

This might not have happened in Australia but it happened in UK. 

But this will fall on deaf ears so I might as well move on. 

No I didn't reply because I despise rehashing the same crap over and over again. 

So you think 10,000 people under 65 years old in the UK have died from covid alone. No other factor whatsoever. Covid just killed them.

If you believe that, that's cool. To each their own. But, even if you believe that, did you know that somewhere around 10-12,000 people die in the UK every single day. There's no age breakdown, but it's not overly necessary. Obviously, it wouldn't take more than two days for there to be as many deaths from other causes - two days, compared to three years of covid. 

But as we all learned over the past three years (and shame on me for forgetting), covid-related deaths, and covid-related deaths alone, are the only ones that matter.  

But what are we even arguing about now? We get on these meaningless tangents and it's a drag to participate, as if I'm trying to trivialise people dying just trying to get very basic points across. 

You seem to think covid was the worst thing that ever happened and the vaccine is the only reason every single one of us is not dead. That's cool. You have a lot of like "minded" people. I completely disagree, and there are pages and pages of the reasons why, if you want to read back over them. 

Edit- I just had a quick look at the median age for covid deaths and it is 83. Median life expectancy is 71 for males, and 75 for females. 83, is the median age for covid deaths. So even if you include all the car accidents that still had covid in their systems, or the like; Eighty Three. Surely something inside that thing up there in your skull thinks that's worthwhile data. 

Edited October 20, 2022 by Geoff

[Glen]

2 hours ago, Geoff said:

you believe that, that's cool. To each their own. But, even if you believe that, did you know that somewhere around 10-12,000 people die in the UK every single day

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Is that a fact. 

At that rate mate, the UK will fail to exist in 15 years.

Moron.

[Glen]

the fact is mate that at its peak, more people were dying per day from COVID than every other cause put together in the UK.

imo, that warrants a response 

[Glen]

At its peak : Covid = around 2000 / day

every other cause put together = 1250? maybe 1300 at a push 

 

[Geoff]

lol, extra zero, but my point remains. Don't know why we keep going over the same thing when I mentioned the proper numbers with the correct amount of zeros many months ago, but we're here again. 

28 minutes ago, Glen said:

the fact is mate that at its peak, more people were dying per day from COVID than every other cause put together in the UK.

imo, that warrants a response 

And I don't really get stuff like this. For years, and even about two or three posts ago, I've agreed a measured response was required for those that the virus affected - NOT a one size fits the entire planet one. What I've taken great issue with is the ridiculously unmeasured nature of the response. And again, just typing exactly what I've said before, but I can't comment from experience on the UK - only Australia. But, as I have also said before, there are plenty of people in the UK who think similarly about covid as I do. You've pumped it up to be everything the media told you it was, but not everyone in your country saw it that way. 

Again, median death age was 83. Life expectancy is low 70's. Children weren't allowed in schools for two years, people were locked out of their countries, livelihoods and jobs lost, no one allowed to see dying loved ones - the whole planet shut down. And the median age of death with covid was 83. But children were not allowed in schools and playgrounds. 

I know you have your bullet points that you hang everything on. Would just love, for one post, to see you consider everything, especially with what you know now. 

[Glen]

8 minutes ago, Geoff said:

lol, extra zero, but my point remains. Don't know why we keep going over the same thing when I mentioned the proper numbers with the correct amount of zeros many months ago, but we're here again. 

And I don't really get stuff like this. For years, and even about two or three posts ago, I've agreed a measured response was required for those that the virus affected - NOT a one size fits the entire planet one. What I've taken great issue with is the ridiculously unmeasured nature of the response. And again, just typing exactly what I've said before, but I can't comment from experience on the UK - only Australia. But, as I have also said before, there are plenty of people in the UK who think similarly about covid as I do. You've pumped it up to be everything the media told you it was, but not everyone in your country saw it that way. 

Again, median death age was 83. Life expectancy is low 70's. Children weren't allowed in schools for two years, people were locked out of their countries, livelihoods and jobs lost, no one allowed to see dying loved ones - the whole planet shut down. And the median age of death with covid was 83. But children were not allowed in schools and playgrounds. 

I know you have your bullet points that you hang everything on. Would just love, for one post, to see you consider everything, especially with what you know now. 

I have and do get that, but in my opinion it was a measured response.

How do you do a measured response just for the affected? What lock the oldies down forever until a vaccine is found and let everyone else crack on as usual lol. 

Basically at the start, 1500 a day were dying at the peak. Hospitals were overwhelmed. That didn't happen in Australia. but it did here.

Only solution was to lock everyone down and it worked 

Summer 2020, I went on hols. Cases were virtually zero. 

Only problem is the fucker came back and even more people were dying by Jan 21 so we locked down again for 8 weeks.

March 21 vaccines rolled out and we gradually opened up.

not sure how else that could have panned out tbh

I get that Australia has over reacted and dragged it out way too long but I won't criticise our government as I think they did the right thing. 

 

[Geoff]

16 minutes ago, Glen said:

I have and do get that, but in my opinion it was a measured response.

How do you do a measured response just for the affected? What lock the oldies down forever until a vaccine is found and let everyone else crack on as usual lol. 

You lol, but what happened instead was less ludicrous? 

It's amazing how PC this world has become that stating the obvious is just out of the question. And the vaccine didn't take forever. If I'm not mistaken you even agreed with me long ago that as soon as the "vulnerable" were all vaccinated that should have been the end of all the madness, but that's not how it played out at all. 

[CureTheSane]

Firstly, you can't compare the UK to Australia, simply because of just how much Australia sucks
Nothing can compare to just how shit a country it is.

Love the argument "covid didn'ty kill anyonme, they were all deaths caused by underlying issues"
This would be the same are cancer patients dying of heart attacked. It wasn't the heart attack that got them , it was because of the cancer.
Or a bind kid walking off a cliff. Wasn't the splatter at the bottom the killed him, it was their blindness tyhat was the cause of death.
Or maybe someone who dies ion a car crach, who happened to be sufferening a cold. Clearly the main cause was the sniffles 

 

[Dead Planet]

The positions on this issue don't change....the same old points being made....trying to change anyone's opinion on covid, restrictions, masking and the vax is a waste of time.....as with most issues these days people believe what they want to believe and cherry pick the 'facts' or articles to support their position...it's starting to feel like a form of desperation tbh....

I started this latest flare up with an article about people refusing blood transfusions because of their unwarranted fears (imo) of the vax and that article was ignored to restart the usual arguments...

 

[Glen]

1 hour ago, Dead Planet said:

trying to change anyone's opinion on covid, restrictions, masking and the vax is a waste of time.

💯

time to move on 

[KarpetRydOFunk]

Anybody wanna, I dunno, maybe talk about music?

Nah, that's a stoopid idea. My bad. I'll just leave. 

[AlphaMale]

19 minutes ago, KarpetRydOFunk said:

Anybody wanna, I dunno, maybe talk about music?

Nah, that's a stoopid idea. My bad. I'll just leave. 

You're leaving? Really?? 

[Geoff]

17 hours ago, Dead Planet said:

I started this latest flare up with an article about people refusing blood transfusions because of their unwarranted fears (imo) of the vax and that article was ignored to restart the usual arguments...

I think the article was ignored because it's like posting an article about a Jewish person stealing a few chocolate bars from his local supermarket during the Holocaust. 

Sure, the dozen or so people the article is probably referring to seem to be making very silly personal decisions for themselves. But pro-vaccine folk have stopped short of calling for criminal charges against unvaccinated people over the last few years, to the point where they were actually banished from society without any justification whatsoever. And these decisions of unvaccinated banishment were supported but every terrified, irrational gronk and their dog. 

So yeah, a dozen or so unvaccinated people may have a few silly ideas about blood transfusions, but have you got an article about the absolute maggots who unjustly targeted unvaccinated people over the last few years? With pfizer's latest admissions, so that even the brainwashed can now understand, that kind of story might invite a little more commentary? 

 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Geoff
Miss-typed sentence amendment

[Glen]

58 minutes ago, Geoff said:

I think the article was ignored because it's like posting an article about a Jewish person stealing a few chocolate bars from his local supermarket during the Holocaust. 

Sure, the dozen or so people the article is probably referring to seem to be making very silly personal decisions for themselves. But pro-vaccine folk have stopped short of calling for criminal charges against unvaccinated people over the last few years, to the point where they were actually banished from society without any justification whatsoever. And these decisions of unvaccinated banishment were supported but every terrified, irrational gronk and their dog. 

So yeah, a dozen or so unvaccinated people may have a few silly ideas about blood transfusions, but have you got an article about what absolute cunts everyone who unjustly targeted unvaccinated people over the last few years have been? With pfizer's latest admissions, so that even the brainwashed can now understand, that kind of story might invite a little more commentary? 

move on mate

 

[auslander]

21 hours ago, Glen said:

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 Is that a fact. 

At that rate mate, the UK will fail to exist in 15 years.

Moron.

Um, who is the moron? Ffs have you heard about births and immigration? Fuck me sometimes fools being fools is just hard to fathom...

Anyone could do a quick google like I did and see Geoff meant 12K per die in the UK approx per week.

Edited October 21, 2022 by auslander

[auslander]

15 hours ago, Dead Planet said:

The positions on this issue don't change....the same old points being made....trying to change anyone's opinion on covid, restrictions, masking and the vax is a waste of time.....as with most issues these days people believe what they want to believe and cherry pick the 'facts' or articles to support their position...it's starting to feel like a form of desperation tbh....

I started this latest flare up with an article about people refusing blood transfusions because of their unwarranted fears (imo) of the vax and that article was ignored to restart the usual arguments...

 

The problem is no-one on the vaccinate- every-living-person-and-his-dog, obey-your-leaders-without-question side is willing to admit, yes covid was bad, but not as bad as health "experts" made out and also that the restrictions were an overreach and in many cases completely unnecessary. That is the only problem. And everytime someone starts to question the decision making, out trots another "look at these stupid anti-vaxxer extremists" media story to distract distract distract from the real issue above. Never will anyone in the always-obey-your-leaders crew will ever admit they were wrong, they were over the top. It is Stamford prison experiment level stuff, this pure folly in accepting anything from authority in the name of so-called safety.

[Glen]

1 hour ago, auslander said:

Um, who is the moron? Ffs have you heard about births and immigration? Fuck me sometimes fools being fools is just hard to fathom...

Anyone could do a quick google like I did and see Geoff meant 12K per die in the UK approx per week.

I've moved on mate, I suggest you do too