Corona

[PeterS]

1 hour ago, CureTheSane said:

Look the disinfectant stuff was pretty funny.
Personally the first time I saw it I assumed he was stating (probably) a fact that disinfectant kills the virus in a minute on contact and that maybe the medical profession might use that kind of starting point to develop something that is injectable that might act the same way.
Maybe I was wrong and he actually was recommending injecting it.

He's probably not helped by having a very small word pool. Whatever he tries to sell about himself he's not the smartest. Good sales, stay away from technical. But he can't stop himself. Top draw entertainment in a car crash type of way but leave the smarts to the smarts. If you want a negotiation then send him in. 

[Leykis101]

No the right would clown him, but nothing like the Dems are, they have made themselves look like fools, Im a libertarian, I don't like either side, but at no point did the Republicans even try a quarter of the bullshit the dems have towards trump, and then to not even be successful doing it, I'd like to start by watching Adam Schiff thrown the fuck out, along with Nazi Pelosi, the presidents injection comments seemed like pure sarcasm to me, I guess I support my president whoever it is, even Barack,

[CureTheSane]

15 hours ago, PeterS said:

He's probably not helped by having a very small word pool. Whatever he tries to sell about himself he's not the smartest. Good sales, stay away from technical. But he can't stop himself. Top draw entertainment in a car crash type of way but leave the smarts to the smarts. If you want a negotiation then send him in. 

100%

[Dead Planet]

I'm not so sure about him being a great negotiator...where is the evidence? Other than what he says about himself...

[nyoilers]

5 hours ago, Dead Planet said:

I'm not so sure about him being a great negotiator...where is the evidence? Other than what he says about himself...

His trade deals are bullshit.I'm for free trade-not what's going on now.

If you mow my lawn and I give you $50 then we're both happy.

I don't need to wash your car for $50 so we're monetarily even.

[Glen]

On 4/26/2020 at 4:21 PM, heavyharmonies said:

No, you got it right. The screechers have been parsing every word and sentence to the nth degree, imputing literal directive/mandate where none was intended.

Like the morons who misinterpreted his statements about hydroxychloroquine and went out and bought FISH TANK CLEANER and drank it. And then the leftist media establishment tried to blame Trump for their death/illness when no sane person would have ever interpreted his statements that way.

Whatever. We're far too deep in this for anyone's opinions to be changed, mine included. Those who defend him will defend him, and those who want to blame him for all the universe's ills, including global warming and genital warts will continue to do so.

well the section I saw he was definitely talking about injecting it.

Which is just plain worrying

[PeterS]

It's like football/soccer fans. If you're a fan of a particular team the referee is always bias , your player who hacks down the opposition player from behind was innocent and the oppositions pies aren't as good as your home pies and the governing body is bias against you. (Difficult analogy for the Americans perhaps but I bet your home hotdogs are better?) 

[PeterS]

1 hour ago, Glen said:

well the section I saw he was definitely talking about injecting it.

Which is just plain worrying

Boy doctor locker room talk. 

[Geoff]

1 hour ago, PeterS said:

It's like football/soccer fans. If you're a fan of a particular team the referee is always bias , your player who hacks down the opposition player from behind was innocent and the oppositions pies aren't as good as your home pies and the governing body is bias against you. (Difficult analogy for the Americans perhaps but I bet your home hotdogs are better?) 

Not necessarily true. I couldn't give the most remote of fucks about US politics or certain individuals, and just make my decisions based on what's before me. Maybe I can be a bit more relaxed in my decisions because my country's not depending on him, but to be honest, the endless pissing and moaning by his detractors is more than enough for me to empathise with him.

It's almost like an underdog type thing. It is just so cool and elitist to hate Trump and use him as a punching bag. If nothing else, it's boring as fuck. All the cool kids absolutely despise Trump. And I despise all the cool kids. And that's the biggest issue I have with it. All the people that hate Trump - I despise their political views and more broadly, their putridly left views on the world. So, without even caring too much about it, I find myself already liking what Trump is doing, if he's pissing these folk off. Because if he is, it means that he must be doing something right. I know that might seem a little childish, but it's just mathematical to me. 

If people with irritating outlooks on life hate a particular person for his outlook on life, then I'm not very inclined to side with them.

In this thread, I prefer Dan's arguments to the arguments against Trump. And when it comes to informed opinions, I far prefer what people "in the know" say in defence of Trump than those "in the know" say against him. 

[CureTheSane]

5 hours ago, Geoff said:

to be honest, the endless pissing and moaning by his detractors is more than enough for me to empathise with him.

It's almost like an underdog type thing. It is just so cool and elitist to hate Trump and use him as a punching bag. If nothing else, it's boring as fuck. All the cool kids absolutely despise Trump. And I despise all the cool kids

Well summed up. 100% feel the same way.

[heavyharmonies]

7 hours ago, Geoff said:

Not necessarily true. I couldn't give the most remote of fucks about US politics or certain individuals, and just make my decisions based on what's before me. Maybe I can be a bit more relaxed in my decisions because my country's not depending on him, but to be honest, the endless pissing and moaning by his detractors is more than enough for me to empathise with him.

It's almost like an underdog type thing. It is just so cool and elitist to hate Trump and use him as a punching bag. If nothing else, it's boring as fuck. All the cool kids absolutely despise Trump. And I despise all the cool kids. And that's the biggest issue I have with it. All the people that hate Trump - I despise their political views and more broadly, their putridly left views on the world. So, without even caring too much about it, I find myself already liking what Trump is doing, if he's pissing these folk off. Because if he is, it means that he must be doing something right. I know that might seem a little childish, but it's just mathematical to me. 

Bingo bango bongo!

This is very much it. My vote in 2016 was not for Trump as much as it was ant-Dem, anti-leftist, anti-establishment, and anti-mainstream media. It was very much a "hold your nose and vote" situation at the time, but his being in office has really brought to light the overarching hypocrisy of the media.

Trump is not the champion I would ever choose, *but* given the opposition, they leave me no choice but to support him.

I am so tired of the progressive left ultra-woke -ist sector of society lecturing me incessantly on how horrible a human being not only Trump is, but by extension I must be if I support anything he does at any time. Also, if you are male, straight, and white, you are by default an evil nazi and should feel guilty for drawing breath.

Mainstream media in January: Trump is a racist for halting travel to/from China.

Mainstream media in April: Trump is a failure because he didn't stop travel to/from China soon enough.

Dafuq? Do you idiots even see what you're saying/writing/tweeting compared to what you said in January/February??

If Trump is pissing them off, then he's doing something right... and that's good enough for me.

[nyoilers]

Trump's not doing anything right and I look forward to voting against him again.

But the sad reality is that there's not much difference between the left and the right.

The small difference is how does it affect me and my family.Everything else like immigration,abortion,climate change,etc... takes a back seat to what's important to me-my retirement ,which the republicans want to cut and healthcare,which is what I want the republicans to leave alone.

The truth from Tony Montana-First you get the money and then you get the power.

I don't have the money so I vote for who's gonna help me out.

[heavyharmonies]

Everyone has their own personal reasons for voting for (or against) certain candidates. You have to vote your conscience and/or what you feel is in your or your family's best interests, or barring that, the country's best interests. What one person decides may not fit the priorities of someone else, and that's perfectly fine.

Leading up to the 2016 election, in my opinion, there was a fundamental shift in how the 2 parties and their supporters treat the opposing faction, especially (in my opinion) from the Left. With Hillary's "basket of deplorables" comment and similar comments, it shifted the criticism from:

"You are suppoorting a bad candidate!"

to:

"You are a bad person for supporting this candidate!"

The difference may seem subtle, but it is monumental in tone and implication. This is what brought about all of the statements like "If you support Trump, you are a racist!" or a sexist, or a homophobe, or [insert pejorative here]. It's projecting the faults and flaws of the candidate onto the people that voted for that candidate, something we had not seen before nearly to the extent we have since.

I actually had someone in my workplace tell me that I was a sexist for voting Republican.

This mindset is so fundamentally flawed and wrong that I rebel against it with every fibre of my being. I loathe identity politics. It is abhorrent.

Anyway, at the end of the day, your vote is your choice, and no one should be castigated for their voting decision.

[Leykis101]

That's how the left treat everything, I mean if your not for this or that for African Americans, your a fucking racist, if your not for black lives matter, racist, not for me too, sexist, if u don't agree with whatever their agenda is, your automatically stereotyped and labeled, it's fucking ridiculous, to the point it's so overused and you see it coming before it ever happens, sleepy Joe is the last person I trust to run the cuntry, dude can't even remember his name.

[Dead Planet]

I agree with the sentiments about the left and the politically correct crowd....the whole PC thing has gotten out of hand, the liberal left has lost its mind as it is getting to the point where you almost have to apologize for being white...its a shame that political parties(not just in the US) are either running to the left or the right....we need parties that walk the line between the 2 polar opposites, centrist or as I prefer to call them, common sense parties...I can understand people voting for Trump either because he represents what they are comfortable with or because they feel there is no other reasonable choice....personaIly I'm tired of both the far left and the far right as neither group represents my vision of how the world should be....I just don't see Trump as the answer for anyones problems...as for Biden I honestly don't know if he would be a good president maybe he will be heavily influenced by the left and make the gulf between the 2 sides even worse than it already is...I do think he deserves a chance...even if you ignore the guy in the oval office and look at what the Republican party stands for, they haven't tried to bring the 2 sides together, IMO they seem more interested in enriching themselves at everyone elses expense by cutting taxes for the rich which was supposed to trickle down to the rest of the country but that didn't happen....

[Dead Planet]

Just when I thought I had heard everything about this virus...we get COVID TOES!!!!

https://news.northwestern.edu/stories/2020/04/covid-toes-probably-more-rampant-than-we-realize/&fj=1

[Glen]

all eyes on Georgia as it reopens. In UK we are being told pubs / restaurants possibly closed for months yet.

[Dead Planet]

Several provinces in Canada are easing restrictions as well...I wonder if the first wave will be over before the 2nd wave hits....... if we need a lesson about this we only have to look at the 1918 influensa epidemic where the 2nd wave was much worse than the first wave... and then there was a third wave...

[Leykis101]

So Ive said this since day 1, check my posts, I believe this virus came out of a lab, in China, I hope on accident, but maybe not, no conspiracy theory, no dramatic plot, my common sense just told me that nothing about any of this seemed logical or even remotely straight up, at any point, my assumption was they were dicking around with population control, since every one of these fucked up odd viruses that come around every few years all seem to begin in China, regardless, shit is starting to become more clear, if you follow the light, you will see what is out there, if you buy anything being presented in any of the bullshit news outlets in America, your being goaded, slowly people are coming forward with bits of info, now a major senator has cracked the egg, going on Ben Shapiro, and basically telling everything Ive suspected from day 1, Ted Cruz stops short of saying that's what caused this, he will never say it, but it doesn't take may IQ points to figure out it's what he's getting at, my thoughts were pretty damn close.and this story feels remarkably believable, like the truth, something none of us I believe have had about any of this, I generally cannot stomach this man, just his face makes me cringe, but this video and the story in it, has made more sense to me then anything else ive heard. YES ITS ON FOX NEWS, SORRY I DON'T CONTROL THE LEFT OR RIGHT AND WHO INTERVIEWS WHO/

 

 

Edited May 2, 2020 by Leykis101

[Darkstone]

Just a random thought regarding the reopening of cinemas and their possible demise. Could we be on the verge of a new age of the drive-in movie? With Bluetooth and the quality of sound systems in cars these days it could be a great experience.

[Mr.AOR]

2 minutes ago, Darkstone said:

Just a random thought regarding the reopening of cinemas and their possible demise. Could we be on the verge of a new age of the drive-in movie? With Bluetooth and the quality of sound systems in cars these days it could be a great experience.

That's what they are doing now in South Korea.

[CureTheSane]

4 hours ago, Darkstone said:

Just a random thought regarding the reopening of cinemas and their possible demise. Could we be on the verge of a new age of the drive-in movie? With Bluetooth and the quality of sound systems in cars these days it could be a great experience.

Yeah I thought the same thing. We atill have drive ins down in Dandenong.
Not sure if they are open, either way it's pretty cold out right now.
When cinemas reopen they will likely be seating people apart I guess

Heard today Victoria has only 50 active cases which if true is looking pretty damn good.
I know other States have had days of zero new cases. I think Northern Territory has had 2 weeks with sero new cases.

[Dead Planet]

Here is an interesting article from the New York Times doing a quick comparison between the US and Canada over the virus....

 

NYTimes.com

May 2, 2020
Two Medical Systems, Two Pandemic Responses

By Ian Austen

After lamenting in a recent Canada Letter about my inability to find an expert who could offer an informed comparison of how the medical systems in Canada and the United States were responding to the coronavirus pandemic, I soon heard from Prof. Peter Berman
He is particularly well placed for such an assessment, after spending 25 years teaching at Harvard, most recently as a professor of global health systems and economics at the T.H. Chan School of Public Health. Professor Berman is now based in Vancouver as the director of the  school of population and public health at the University of British Columbia’s medical school.

I’ll begin the comparison with some numbers. Massachusetts, the previous home of Professor Berman, has a population of 6.8 million and  British Columbia has slightly over five million residents. But the toll of the pandemic on the two areas has been significantly different.  As of Friday afternoon in Massachusetts, there have been more than 62,000 reported cases and 3,562 deaths, or 52 fatalities for every  100,000 people. In B.C., there have been just 2,112 reported cases and 111 deaths or just two victims for every 100,000 residents.

Professor Berman cautioned that those numbers reflect a wide variety of factors outside the medical system like the demographic makeup  of different cities and regions.

But he noted that near his old office at Harvard “there must be thousands of the world’s best hospital beds and there are three top
 international top hospitals within a couple blocks.” So with resources like that, why is there such a great disparity with British
 Columbia?

Part of the answer, for Professor Berman, can be found in how hospitals are funded and managed by the public health care systems of
 Canadian provinces.

“The kind of system we have in Canada — and I think in British Columbia we have a pretty well-run version of it — allows the public
health authorities to essentially commandeer the hospital system. It’s a command and control thing, it’s not a coordination thing,”
he said.

In the United States, Professor Berman said, hospitals are largely private institutions without any overall control.

The effect of having these different systems plays out in many ways.

“In British Columbia, the province just said: ‘We need to get ready for this, we need to free up 30 percent of the hospital beds,’”
Professor Berman said. “And they instructed the health authorities to do it.”

But in Massachusetts, he said, not only was there no one to tell hospitals to clear out beds, the economics of the system work against
 such steps.

“If you have a private hospital where all the beds are paid for by patients and by insurance, when you have an empty bed, you have no
revenue,” Professor Berman said. “So there’s a strong incentive for the hospital managers, especially in trying economic times, to be
 reluctant to cooperate. And then you end up with this kind of panicky atmosphere that has been happening in the U.S. where people are  saying: ‘We don’t have enough beds, we don’t have enough this, we don’t have enough that.’”

By contrast, Canadian hospitals have fixed funding. The number of full or empty beds has no effect on their budgets.
The structure in the United States leads to other problems. Few American hospital administrators got together to do things like moving
 medical supplies and patients around between their institutions, Professor Berman said.

“They have a strong disincentive not to do that and in addition there is no one who can make them do that without a pretty heavy duty
expression of police powers of the state, which we haven’t really seen happening,” he said.

Professor Berman also noted that while the American system has vast medical and scientific expertise, there’s little national
 coordination. Instead, responsibility has been fractured among a variety of long established agencies like the Centers for Disease
 Control, the National Institutes of Health and the coronavirus task force established by President Trump.

“So you see these different agencies being brought in to weigh in with their opinions without any sense of who’s really the spokesperson,”  he said. In Canada however, “at a national level, Theresa Tam is doing that and then at the provincial level, we have people like Bonnie  Henry doing that. I think in the U.S., no one’s been allowed to do that.”

None of this means that Canada’s approach to the crisis and the structure of its medical system is perfect. Among other things, Professor  Berman said that Canada’s health systems, which effectively treat doctors as private contractors, sometimes leads to disconnections  between primary health care and the hospital systems. He also said that the country has been slow to push testing for the virus out  into communities.

But none of that has led to the sort of response he’s seeing back in the United States.

“I’m a health economist,” Professor Berman said. “So the argument is always given in the United States that we have a lot of innovation,
 the system is very efficient and so on. But this is the other side of the argument.”

 

[heavyharmonies]

Each system has its upsides and downsides depending on the scenario in play and what the demands are upon each system.

In times of urgent need (war, pandemic, natural disaster) there's an advantage to centralized absolute control and "one size fits all". The rest of the time, the opposite can be true.

Focus on triage and urgent care is different from focus on innovation and research. Typically people in countries with socialized healthcare wait longer and don't receive the same level of specialized care, but in a pinch they're able to coordinate and move quicker since they're used to authoritarian control. There's less questioning or pushback.

We're now seeing one side of the spectrum under the microscope. The question is whether  changing the system to accommodate the exception justifies sacrificing the quality of the norm.

I can't answer that. I just know that they will be shrieking regardless of the choice.

[Doggy]

10 hours ago, CureTheSane said:

Yeah I thought the same thing. We atill have drive ins down in Dandenong.
Not sure if they are open, either way it's pretty cold out right now.
When cinemas reopen they will likely be seating people apart I guess

Heard today Victoria has only 50 active cases which if true is looking pretty damn good.
I know other States have had days of zero new cases. I think Northern Territory has had 2 weeks with sero new cases.

Dandenong is in quarantine at the moment since 22 0f March.

Means the Hard Rubbish ( Trash ) and Treasure market is in the same boat.