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Guns 'N' Roses - Chinese Democracy


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Wow mateys, 'classic' is a huge call, but it's... different. :)

Admittedly it's too early for me to tell what the staying power will be overall, but I would not hesitate to say it is by far one of the most diverse and interesting albums to be released this year. :)

 

I'll agree with the interesting and diverse comment but I haven't got to the point of calling it classic yet.

I do think it's very good, but just with it was called Axl Rose instead of GNR.

And as Pete said it's also to early for me to tell what kind of staying power it's gonna have.

Before you even ask, yes I know how fucking lazy I am... ;)

 

Here's a post I put on another board asking whether people liked the old Guns or the new... just figured I'd throw it out there 'cause that's just how I am. Techinically I totally agree with your comment about calling it "Axl Rose" as opposed to G'n'R but with the marketing power of the G'n'R name, I can say for sure I would have done the same thing as he did! :devil:

 

I like 'em both, Axl's songwriting fuels the fire of both entities IMO. The styles of the individual musicians adds a different flavor on the newer stuff, but to me you've still got Axl at the heart of it, maybe even more so since he's got a lot more control with the new project.

 

If anything, Chinese Democracy continues the creative progression from Use Your Illusion. Complex arrangements, sweeping almost soundtrack style instrumental melodies. The main thing that I don't see in the new stuff is the raw, bluesy style of Slash and the rest of the old crew (who other than Slash and Duff, changed a couple times between Appetite and Illusion and beyond).

 

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Appetite, and Use Your Illusion was very good, but would have been better distilled down into one album as opposed to the filler laden two disc extravaganza. Lies was okay, and Spaghetti Incident was a fucking cover album so IMHO we're only looking at two "real" releases by the band, and it had changed significantly between the two. Not sure why there's so much hating with the new stuff. It's got a few modern bells and whistles here and there, but underneath is 14 ambitious Axl Rose songs, they sure as hell aren't modern/alternative sounding, if anything maybe a bit TOO ambitious.

 

Overall I think it's by far one of the most interesting albums to come out this year and has the potential of becoming a classic. That being said, Appetite already is a classic and I don't think that will change anytime soon. Bottom line, everyone's got the right to an opinion, but only my opinion is actually right...

 

...kidding, either you like it or you don't, but having listened to the album numerous times I can say without a doubt that Axl put his heart and soul into this. It's up to you whether you like it or not. :-)

 

I think the above gives a perfect description about what Chinese Democracy really is. It's Axl's very own creative input which naturally means the raw Blues and straight forward Hard Rock of the rest of the gang is absent. However what I'd like to add is that I think it lacks some catchyness. I don't see no surefire hit potention ala Paradise City, Sweet Child 'O Mine here noir UYI's You Could Be Mine or Don't Cry even though some songs are close it's basically another level. I do see the other components such as epicness and drama. Overall a pretty good achievement for a solo input, not a big fan of the Industrial attempts though. This one's obviously purely for the fans as there's no promotion or whatsoever.

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I agree with the post.

This album was released for the fans and has the potential to be a classic.

Almost all the songs are very listenable and get better each time.

I think many songs are catchy enough. Sure, the original hair metal sound from Appetite is gone meaning no monster ballads or Hard rockers but the songs are catchy enough in comparison to today's music and so I think the album is a very good one.

As far as calling it Guns N' Roses, Axl has every right to call it a Guns N' Roses release.

Since Whitesnake is just Coverdale, I consider Guns N' Roses to be just Axl.

The original Guns had Tracii Guns on guitar and since he's not present, it technically hasn't been Guns... ever since.

Plus Tommy Stinson, Dizzy Reed, Richard Fortus and Robin Finck (if he carries on being in the band) have been in the band for years so I don't think it is just a band full of session musicians.

Axl IS Guns N' Roses. The others left him in the lurch and he's bravely fought on and put up great concerts for people all over the world and now he's put out a killer album. It can only get better for Guns N' Roses at this point.

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I don't see no surefire hit potention ala Paradise City, Sweet Child 'O Mine here noir UYI's You Could Be Mine or Don't Cry even though some songs are close it's basically another level.

Yeah, whether there's a single or not phases me 0%, but I agree with where this statement's going. And this relates to my issue with the last Skid Row disc too, and why I thought it did not deserve the "Skid Row" tag. These bands create a style throughout the years and those few "commercial" rock tunes on every disc were a huge part of GNR's sound... and they are not here. I can't picture any of these songs on the radio in any era. That is not a bad thing at all. Just further evidence that it's no GNR. An interesting album yes indeed it still is.

 

Everytime I hear it I get this image of an insane, troubled genius sitting at his huge piano/organ on a dark and stormy night pulling his har out.

 

Here's a post I put on another board asking whether people liked the old Guns or the new...

So you fequent other message boards besides this one? Shame on you. :lol:

Slut.

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The others left him in the lurch and he's bravely fought on and put up great concerts for people all over the world and now he's put out a killer album. It can only get better for Guns N' Roses at this point.

 

How did they leave him in a lurch?

Axl threw a shit fit on the UYI tour so they'd sign over the band to him and then he eventually forced them all out of the band, so I think it was more like he left them in a lurch. :unsure:

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The others left him in the lurch and he's bravely fought on and put up great concerts for people all over the world and now he's put out a killer album. It can only get better for Guns N' Roses at this point.

 

How did they leave him in a lurch?

Axl threw a shit fit on the UYI tour so they'd sign over the band to him and then he eventually forced them all out of the band, so I think it was more like he left them in a lurch. :unsure:

 

Steven was fired because he was fucked up, Izzy left because Axl was so demanding and hard to handle, Slash and Duff left because Axl went on hours late every single night on the UYI tour, letting down the people that paid for tickets (and in the 3 years they were supposed to be writing an album, he was never at rehearsal, and when he was he never sang.....infact Slash says the last time he heard Axl sing was the last date of the UYI tour in 92), and Matt was fired when he stood up for Slash at rehearsal...

 

and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

 

it all leads back to Axl the way i see it...cept for Steven, then again, maybe he was doing that many drugs to cope with touring with Axl? who knows :unsure:

 

infact, the only guy thats still with the band who was on the UYI tour is Dizzy, who obviously was always more Axls friend than anyone elses, otherwise he would have followed Slash, Duff and Matt out of principle

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The others left him in the lurch and he's bravely fought on and put up great concerts for people all over the world and now he's put out a killer album. It can only get better for Guns N' Roses at this point.

 

How did they leave him in a lurch?

Axl threw a shit fit on the UYI tour so they'd sign over the band to him and then he eventually forced them all out of the band, so I think it was more like he left them in a lurch. :unsure:

 

Steven was fired because he was fucked up, Izzy left because Axl was so demanding and hard to handle, Slash and Duff left because Axl went on hours late every single night on the UYI tour, letting down the people that paid for tickets (and in the 3 years they were supposed to be writing an album, he was never at rehearsal, and when he was he never sang.....infact Slash says the last time he heard Axl sing was the last date of the UYI tour in 92), and Matt was fired when he stood up for Slash at rehearsal...

 

and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

 

it all leads back to Axl the way i see it...cept for Steven, then again, maybe he was doing that many drugs to cope with touring with Axl? who knows :unsure:

 

infact, the only guy thats still with the band who was on the UYI tour is Dizzy, who obviously was always more Axls friend than anyone elses, otherwise he would have followed Slash, Duff and Matt out of principle

 

The sad thing about Adler is that they were ALL just as fucked up as he was.

I remember when Izzy left the band, I was pissed.

And to me that was when that band starting heading south IMO.

Izzy was the Keith Richards of that band and was a good rhythm player and was a huge part of the songwriting process.

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The others left him in the lurch and he's bravely fought on and put up great concerts for people all over the world and now he's put out a killer album. It can only get better for Guns N' Roses at this point.

 

How did they leave him in a lurch?

Axl threw a shit fit on the UYI tour so they'd sign over the band to him and then he eventually forced them all out of the band, so I think it was more like he left them in a lurch. :unsure:

 

Steven was fired because he was fucked up, Izzy left because Axl was so demanding and hard to handle, Slash and Duff left because Axl went on hours late every single night on the UYI tour, letting down the people that paid for tickets (and in the 3 years they were supposed to be writing an album, he was never at rehearsal, and when he was he never sang.....infact Slash says the last time he heard Axl sing was the last date of the UYI tour in 92), and Matt was fired when he stood up for Slash at rehearsal...

 

and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

 

it all leads back to Axl the way i see it...cept for Steven, then again, maybe he was doing that many drugs to cope with touring with Axl? who knows :unsure:

 

infact, the only guy thats still with the band who was on the UYI tour is Dizzy, who obviously was always more Axls friend than anyone elses, otherwise he would have followed Slash, Duff and Matt out of principle

 

The sad thing about Adler is that they were ALL just as fucked up as he was.

I remember when Izzy left the band, I was pissed.

And to me that was when that band starting heading south IMO.

Izzy was the Keith Richards of that band and was a good rhythm player and was a huge part of the songwriting process.

 

i never usually care abuot the rhythm players, cause they just double up what the lead guys doing....but with GnR i liked Izzy as much as Slash, theyre like PB&J, great apart, but perfect together..

 

needless to say, he was the influence for my stage name, seriously underrated thanks to being in the same band as Slash :(

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The others left him in the lurch and he's bravely fought on and put up great concerts for people all over the world and now he's put out a killer album. It can only get better for Guns N' Roses at this point.

 

How did they leave him in a lurch?

Axl threw a shit fit on the UYI tour so they'd sign over the band to him and then he eventually forced them all out of the band, so I think it was more like he left them in a lurch. :unsure:

 

Steven was fired because he was fucked up, Izzy left because Axl was so demanding and hard to handle, Slash and Duff left because Axl went on hours late every single night on the UYI tour, letting down the people that paid for tickets (and in the 3 years they were supposed to be writing an album, he was never at rehearsal, and when he was he never sang.....infact Slash says the last time he heard Axl sing was the last date of the UYI tour in 92), and Matt was fired when he stood up for Slash at rehearsal...

 

and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

 

it all leads back to Axl the way i see it...cept for Steven, then again, maybe he was doing that many drugs to cope with touring with Axl? who knows :unsure:

 

infact, the only guy thats still with the band who was on the UYI tour is Dizzy, who obviously was always more Axls friend than anyone elses, otherwise he would have followed Slash, Duff and Matt out of principle

 

The sad thing about Adler is that they were ALL just as fucked up as he was.

I remember when Izzy left the band, I was pissed.

And to me that was when that band starting heading south IMO.

Izzy was the Keith Richards of that band and was a good rhythm player and was a huge part of the songwriting process.

 

i never usually care abuot the rhythm players, cause they just double up what the lead guys doing....but with GnR i liked Izzy as much as Slash, theyre like PB&J, great apart, but perfect together..

 

needless to say, he was the influence for my stage name, seriously underrated thanks to being in the same band as Slash :(

 

I felt like Mick Cripps in LA Guns also was very solid rhythm player and songwriter too.

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and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

That's awesome. I just wish everyone else thought the same as Axl when it came to Gilby and he had been left without recorded material.

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I don't see no surefire hit potention ala Paradise City, Sweet Child 'O Mine here noir UYI's You Could Be Mine or Don't Cry even though some songs are close it's basically another level.

Yeah, whether there's a single or not phases me 0%, but I agree with where this statement's going. And this relates to my issue with the last Skid Row disc too, and why I thought it did not deserve the "Skid Row" tag. These bands create a style throughout the years and those few "commercial" rock tunes on every disc were a huge part of GNR's sound... and they are not here. I can't picture any of these songs on the radio in any era. That is not a bad thing at all. Just further evidence that it's no GNR. An interesting album yes indeed it still is.

 

Everytime I hear it I get this image of an insane, troubled genius sitting at his huge piano/organ on a dark and stormy night pulling his har out.

 

Here's a post I put on another board asking whether people liked the old Guns or the new...

So you fequent other message boards besides this one? Shame on you. :lol:

Slut.

Guilty! I have so much to give, and sometimes one board just isn't enough. ;)

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Still spinning this in my car this morning and something is obvious.

 

This was a great CD to have in my car over the weekend - casually driving to the beach or to the shops - short stints here and there, a few songs per drive. But on the way to work this morning, I just wanted a good solid 40min listen that'd kick my ass. That is not this CD.

 

I don't know, there's still something I almost like about this G N'R album. As I keep saying, it's far from great but I would definitely listen to this over the likes of Valentine - 'Soul Salvation', Shadowman, Overland and those really tired bored sounding AOR albums that get released these day. Don't know how much that says, but I kind of appreciate what's going on on this CD much more than uninspired drivel.

 

 

Keep listening....the first few spins for me were good...after that I decided this was a great album. I have played it nonstop for two weeks straight.

Wow, we actually agree on this one, I think it may be a classic, I really do. Fantastic stuff, very dynamic, and very passionate, at least to my ears. :)

 

 

 

Why is that shocking bro :) Yes, I agree...it will be a classic in my house anyway ;)

Backed...It is a GREAT release...the more I play it the better it gets...It's a

classic IMO too... :banger:

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and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

That's awesome. I just wish everyone else thought the same as Axl when it came to Gilby and he had been left without recorded material.

 

what do you mean? the only thing Gilby did in the studio was play on The Spaghetti Incident...

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and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

That's awesome. I just wish everyone else thought the same as Axl when it came to Gilby and he had been left without recorded material.

 

what do you mean? the only thing Gilby did in the studio was play on The Spaghetti Incident...

Hasn't he done some solo discs? I swear I've heard some.

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and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

That's awesome. I just wish everyone else thought the same as Axl when it came to Gilby and he had been left without recorded material.

 

what do you mean? the only thing Gilby did in the studio was play on The Spaghetti Incident...

Hasn't he done some solo discs? I swear I've heard some.

 

He was in some pop band in the 80's and Kills for Thrills prior to GNR and has done at least 4 solo albums plus Rockstar Supernova.

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and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

That's awesome. I just wish everyone else thought the same as Axl when it came to Gilby and he had been left without recorded material.

 

what do you mean? the only thing Gilby did in the studio was play on The Spaghetti Incident...

Hasn't he done some solo discs? I swear I've heard some.

 

He was in some pop band in the 80's and Kills for Thrills prior to GNR and has done at least 4 solo albums plus Rockstar Supernova.

Yeah, thought so. I think Sambora just misunderstood what I was saying.

 

I think of that lot (though I've only heard about 2 of his solo discs) I'd have to say the Kill For Thrills disc is the best... and that's hardly a compliment.

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Man, way too much to read in this thread.........

 

I did a little skimming of the posts and decided that Geoff pretty much mirrored my thoughts, though he was more enthusiastic than I am.

 

IMO, pretty lame album with 2-3 decent songs. Nothing at all memorable.

 

We waited how many years for this? :unsure:

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  • 3 months later...
i got this recently (a gift) and must say I was pleasnatly surprised. yes, i actually quite like this one.

Apart from some shitty intros, it's a pretty good allround album.

 

 

 

Still my favorite album released last year. Great stuff!

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I think it was far too easy for people to hate this before it was even released, so I dont think its always judged by people on its true merits.

 

I for one was undecided as to wheter this would be any good or not, and thankfully I loved it.

I would not go as far as to say its their (I still say their as I hate it when people bitch that this isnt GNR when nobody bitches about Whitesnake etc) best work, but it certainly wasnt a disapointment.

 

I had this on constant rotation for a few weeks, which is always a sign that an album is great to my ears!

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I think it was far too easy for people to hate this before it was even released, so I dont think its always judged by people on its true merits.

 

I for one was undecided as to wheter this would be any good or not, and thankfully I loved it.

I would not go as far as to say its their (I still say their as I hate it when people bitch that this isnt GNR when nobody bitches about Whitesnake etc) best work, but it certainly wasnt a disapointment.

 

I had this on constant rotation for a few weeks, which is always a sign that an album is great to my ears!

Backed...I still think that it's great... :drink:

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and if you wanna count Gilby, he was fired because Axl didnt want him writing for the new album, cause he was a hired gun in Axls mind

That's awesome. I just wish everyone else thought the same as Axl when it came to Gilby and he had been left without recorded material.

 

what do you mean? the only thing Gilby did in the studio was play on The Spaghetti Incident...

Hasn't he done some solo discs? I swear I've heard some.

 

He was in some pop band in the 80's and Kills for Thrills prior to GNR and has done at least 4 solo albums plus Rockstar Supernova.

Yeah, thought so. I think Sambora just misunderstood what I was saying.

 

I think of that lot (though I've only heard about 2 of his solo discs) I'd have to say the Kill For Thrills disc is the best... and that's hardly a compliment.

 

yeah i thought you were referring to Slash, Duff et. al when you said "Everyone else" referrign to just Guns stuff...i own his album "the Hangover" like the Izzy Stradlin and the Ju Ju Hounds disc its one that didnt exactly blow me away at first but i still spin it on occasion for kicks :P

 

I think it was far too easy for people to hate this before it was even released, so I dont think its always judged by people on its true merits.

 

I for one was undecided as to wheter this would be any good or not, and thankfully I loved it.

I would not go as far as to say its their (I still say their as I hate it when people bitch that this isnt GNR when nobody bitches about Whitesnake etc) best work, but it certainly wasnt a disapointment.

 

I had this on constant rotation for a few weeks, which is always a sign that an album is great to my ears!

 

my thoughts exactly, i love this album....it IS Guns N Roses ive decided, i think at the end of the day Slash played a big part but Axl is the sound of GnR just like Seb Bach is Skid Row to me...its good, its got a raunchy GnR sound but then too its also got a really polished, almost progressive sound to it (some of these songs are much more than the straightforward rockers they had in the 80s)

 

i wouldnt be so hasty to say its a masterpiece, but it surpassed my expectations, i only wanted it as a completist but its been in my CD player for 3 months now....i seriously havent taken it out yet :P

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