Categorizing music into genres - is it good or bad for artists?

[Glen]

Are Dream Theater prog metal?

I tried so hard to get into them, but just couldn't

I have a few albums, from memory the only song i really took to was a cover of the Elton John song Love Lies Bleeding

Dream Theater are a poor mans Threshold

[KarpetRydOFunk]

 

Are Dream Theater prog metal?

Wikipedia says they are,if you trust them. I've never really got what makes a piece 'progressive' (although from various comments I gather they tend to be long?)

Length can be an element. Changing time signatures, recurring themes, often a more Classical approach to song composition, the use of uncommon instruments, these are all elements of Progressive Rock and Metal.

[KarpetRydOFunk]

Are Dream Theater prog metal?

I tried so hard to get into them, but just couldn't

I have a few albums, from memory the only song i really took to was a cover of the Elton John song Love Lies Bleeding

Check out Circus Maximus. They are Progressive Metal, but they are very Melodic. I'd start with their album Nine.

[Silverkin]

 

 

Are Dream Theater prog metal?

Wikipedia says they are,if you trust them. I've never really got what makes a piece 'progressive' (although from various comments I gather they tend to be long?)

Length can be an element. Changing time signatures, recurring themes, often a more Classical approach to song composition, the use of uncommon instruments, these are all elements of Progressive Rock and Metal.

Ah, sounds like I should love it then! Is Frank Zappa prog?

The only album I know for sure that's considered prog rock is Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon and I've not been able to sit through that one, which is a shame as I know it's considered one of the 'must have' albums by a lot of people. There must be some that I would enjoy though surely!

[KarpetRydOFunk]

 

 

I dont like Power Metal....there, I said it

 

Power metal is horrible.

 

And so is prog stuff.

My prog universe is early Marillion and Threshold (esp Mac era)

 

Thats about it lol.

No Genesis?

[Silverkin]

the only song i really took to was a cover of the Elton John song Love Lies Bleeding

Ohhh I'd forgotten that Elton John song!! I used to play that over and over on full volume in my younger days

[Glen]

 

 

 

I dont like Power Metal....there, I said it

 

Power metal is horrible.

 

And so is prog stuff.

My prog universe is early Marillion and Threshold (esp Mac era)

 

Thats about it lol.

No Genesis?

I dont own any.

[CureTheSane]

 

Are Dream Theater prog metal?

I tried so hard to get into them, but just couldn't

I have a few albums, from memory the only song i really took to was a cover of the Elton John song Love Lies Bleeding

Check out Circus Maximus. They are Progressive Metal, but they are very Melodic. I'd start with their album Nine.

 

 

Bookmarked for future investigation.

Just listened to a bit on YouTube and it made me realise that I do like some prog music.

Based on what I've heard I'd class Dracula - Swing Of Death as somewhat progressive, and I love that album.

[Nightrain]

 

Categorizing music is important mainly to record stores back in the days because why on earth a jazz fans waste his time in rock sections, and sometimes rock fans don't really like metal so browsing a hard rock / AOR is much more fun.

Ahh so it is good more for browsability reasons to some extent? So ideally,in a record store it would be better for artists if they were shelved in multiple genres where possible? (Like the Hoobastank album I was looking for could have gone in Metal,Rock+mainstream sections)

 

 

Browsability (is that even a word lol) is one thing, but categorizing is also important for media, such as magazine. For example, AOR / Melodic Rock can be classified in one section (for reviews, previews, or any related news) while Hard Rock and Heavy Metal can be grouped in another section. There are maybe some bands that can fit in these two sections, but there are few others are really not, such as now Deep Purple can be grouped as AOR and Foreigner in hard rock, it's very obvious.

[Nightrain]

Are Dream Theater prog metal?

I tried so hard to get into them, but just couldn't

I have a few albums, from memory the only song i really took to was a cover of the Elton John song Love Lies Bleeding

 

Dream Theater is not just a prog metal band, they're one of the pioneers back in the early days, together with Queensryche and Fates Warning. These latter two are more into heavy metal while Dream Theater can venture into heavier territory such as thrash. A media once labelled them as an exciting new band that combines both YES and METALLICA, well not too far off i guess.

 

If you can appreciate those two bands, chances are you're gonna like Dream Theater, but if not, then it's hard. If you dislike old prog stuffs (like Genesis, Yes, King Crimson, Pink Floyd etc) and only into thrash/heavy metal stuffs, there are still some songs that you can appreciate. For me, I love 2 albums, 'Image and Words', one of their most accessible albums and maybe the best album in 1992, and the second one is 'Scenes From A Memory' from 1999. The third thing that I like is their 2011 album with Mike Mangini, but the rest well are maybe strictly for fans, but still you can make one great compilation from them.

[KarpetRydOFunk]

 

Are Dream Theater prog metal?

I tried so hard to get into them, but just couldn't

I have a few albums, from memory the only song i really took to was a cover of the Elton John song Love Lies Bleeding

Dream Theater is not just a prog metal band, they're one of the pioneers back in the early days, together with Queensryche and Fates Warning. These latter two are more into heavy metal while Dream Theater can venture into heavier territory such as thrash. A media once labelled them as an exciting new band that combines both YES and METALLICA, well not too far off i guess.

 

If you can appreciate those two bands, chances are you're gonna like Dream Theater, but if not, then it's hard. If you dislike old prog stuffs (like Genesis, Yes, King Crimson, Pink Floyd etc) and only into thrash/heavy metal stuffs, there are still some songs that you can appreciate. For me, I love 2 albums, 'Image and Words', one of their most accessible albums and maybe the best album in 1992, and the second one is 'Scenes From A Memory' from 1999. The third thing that I like is their 2011 album with Mike Mangini, but the rest well are maybe strictly for fans, but still you can make one great compilation from them.

Octavarium is prolly my favourite.

[Glen]

They are too pretentious and 'wanky'....as soon as you think you are listening to a good song they go all 'wanky' with some ridiculous keyboard noise or something which has no tune or melody

[Silverkin]

 

 

Browsability (is that even a word lol).

There are maybe some bands that can fit in these two sections, but there are few others are really not, such as now Deep Purple can be grouped as AOR and Foreigner in hard rock, it's very obvious.

 

Haha, I like making up new words (like some enjoy making up new sub genres). You knew what I meant though so maybe it should make its way into the dictionary.

 

I definitely get why you need the major groupings (like Metal, rock, classical, C&W, jazz etc). Plus some sub genres (like baroque, atonal, operatic etc within the classical arena; bluegrass, traditional, contemporary etc etc within C&W for example).

Plus, like you say, it is obvious why it would help in stores, magazines etc.

I was questioning more why there are so many obscure sub genres and if that helps or hinders an artist if they get pigeon holed into a certain one.

 

Also, if a band chooses (or their record label chooses to) categorise them as a specific genre or sub genre but they actually have a crossover sound then they could potentially be limiting their audience big time and surely the aim of most serious artists is to get their work out there to be seen, heard, worn or used - depending on what art form it is?

 

On the other hand, creating niche markets for your work may well be the aim in which case sub genreing would actually be a positive thing.

 

Guess it's one of those discussions that doesn't have a definite answer, it all depends on what the artist is after as well as what the audience is looking for and as everyone is beautifully individual there will be a billion trillion answers

[Geoff]

 

 

 

Power metal is horrible.

 

And so is prog stuff.

 

 

Now that just smacks of someone saying that power metal is for bogans and far too heavy for them.

 

 

 

You think power metal is heavy? Why? Since when has speed equaled heaviness? It's no heavier than most hard rock; it just has that ridiculous, shitty, pointless same-on-every-single-song-ever-made shitty drum track. But heavy? Don't think so, mate.

 

Even those current bands you guys call "pop metal" are 10 times heavier than those pousuers.

 

But yeah, power metal probably is for bogans. I don't know mate, you're telling the story. But it's not too heavy for anyone - just too bad.

 

I love how you say I made these incorrect assumptions about you and stuff, but keep saying how I am apparently an AOR die-hard. Where did you get that from?

[CureTheSane]

Lighten up dude. It was just a bit of fun making a stupid comment which to me was as stupid as you interpreting my "too AOR" as "pussy ass gay music" or whatever you said.

But my comment wasn't even serious anyway, it was just fun.

 

Thank christ I pointed out that I just put a winkie smilie in some other thread. Otherwise you'd see that as an attack as well.

It's all fun, don't get so upset.

I thought we'd moved beyond this bickering and puffy chest stage *sad face*

[Geoff]

Lighten up dude. It was just a bit of fun making a stupid comment which to me was as stupid as you interpreting my "too AOR" as "pussy ass gay music" or whatever you said.

 

But my comment wasn't even serious anyway, it was just fun.

 

Thank christ I pointed out that I just put a winkie smilie in some other thread. Otherwise you'd see that as an attack as well.

It's all fun, don't get so upset.

I thought we'd moved beyond this bickering and puffy chest stage *sad face*

 

You know me too well! I am extremely darkened up and taking everything very seriously. I see everything as an attack and am extremely upset. You got me down to a T!

[CureTheSane]

 

Lighten up dude. It was just a bit of fun making a stupid comment which to me was as stupid as you interpreting my "too AOR" as "pussy ass gay music" or whatever you said.

 

But my comment wasn't even serious anyway, it was just fun.

 

Thank christ I pointed out that I just put a winkie smilie in some other thread. Otherwise you'd see that as an attack as well.

It's all fun, don't get so upset.

I thought we'd moved beyond this bickering and puffy chest stage *sad face*

 

You know me too well! I am extremely darkened up and taking everything very seriously. I see everything as an attack and am extremely upset. You got me down to a T!

 

 

Obviously.

I really want to pat you on the head abd tell you it will all be ok (in a very non gay way)

[Geoff]

 

 

Lighten up dude. It was just a bit of fun making a stupid comment which to me was as stupid as you interpreting my "too AOR" as "pussy ass gay music" or whatever you said.

 

But my comment wasn't even serious anyway, it was just fun.

 

Thank christ I pointed out that I just put a winkie smilie in some other thread. Otherwise you'd see that as an attack as well.

It's all fun, don't get so upset.

I thought we'd moved beyond this bickering and puffy chest stage *sad face*

 

You know me too well! I am extremely darkened up and taking everything very seriously. I see everything as an attack and am extremely upset. You got me down to a T!

 

 

Obviously.

I really want to pat you on the head abd tell you it will all be ok (in a very non gay way)

 

 

But how can it be okay when I'm so upset! Don't worry mate, everything is all under control.

 

And I like very gay ways, fyi.

[Glen]

Yaaaawn. Enough of this now. Hug and make up

[Gibbo]

 

 

Are Dream Theater prog metal?

I tried so hard to get into them, but just couldn't

I have a few albums, from memory the only song i really took to was a cover of the Elton John song Love Lies Bleeding

Dream Theater is not just a prog metal band, they're one of the pioneers back in the early days, together with Queensryche and Fates Warning. These latter two are more into heavy metal while Dream Theater can venture into heavier territory such as thrash. A media once labelled them as an exciting new band that combines both YES and METALLICA, well not too far off i guess.

 

If you can appreciate those two bands, chances are you're gonna like Dream Theater, but if not, then it's hard. If you dislike old prog stuffs (like Genesis, Yes, King Crimson, Pink Floyd etc) and only into thrash/heavy metal stuffs, there are still some songs that you can appreciate. For me, I love 2 albums, 'Image and Words', one of their most accessible albums and maybe the best album in 1992, and the second one is 'Scenes From A Memory' from 1999. The third thing that I like is their 2011 album with Mike Mangini, but the rest well are maybe strictly for fans, but still you can make one great compilation from them.

Octavarium is prolly my favourite.

 

 

'When Dream And Day Unite' is my favourite ... I haven't managed to get through a whole Dream Theater album since ...

[Fat Freddy]

There are only two musical genres:

 

1. Stuff that's good.

2. Stuff that sucks.

 

(drops mic)

[Spyne]

I agree with Fat Freddy. Either good or sucks, Haha I think labels are both good and bad. Being labeled as something can be kind of limiting and people automatically assume that you sound a certain way. On the other hand, it is a way to give people somewhat of an idea what your band or another band kind of sounds like.

[Silverkin]

Being labeled as something can be kind of limiting and people automatically assume that you sound a certain way. On the other hand, it is a way to give people somewhat of an idea what your band or another band kind of sounds like.

 

Yeah, I think ideally (in stores at least) a lot of bands could benefit from being marketed and shelved in multiple sections especially if there is crossover sounds with the tracks on the album. Okay, if you have an album and every track is totally similar e.g. with screaming vocals/manic drumming or whatever then it makes sense to put it in the thrash metal section - apologies maybe 'thrash' metal would be the wrong section for that style but I'm not too hot on recognising my genres!

 

I'll have a listen to your band and see if I'd have thought to look in the hard rock section if I was trying to buy it.