Corona

[auslander]

3 hours ago, Dead Planet said:

The media and politicians are pro-police because the vast majority of the people they serve are pro-police and until that changes you will not see either group turn against the police....which is how it should be, the more difficult we make the job of policing, the harder it will be to get people to do the job so even if you are upset with how things are being done during the pandemic, maybe you should give the cops a little bit of understanding...

Yeah why not. I have read stories how Soviets used to sing Communist praise songs as they got shipped off to gulags, never believing their government and the police that served the government could ever turn against them. Let's all sit around a campfire as our rights are removed and all our movements are enthusiastically policed. We the sheeple.

[Metal T]

         

[auslander]

11 hours ago, Metal T said:

         

He also oversees the torture of thousands of dogs every month in North African laboratories, but that's another story.

[Geoff]

19 hours ago, heavyharmonies said:

I don't know how "firefighters" are defined or utilized in Australia vs. here in the USA, but presumably they are included because as first responders they may be called upon to rescue or render medical attention to people, and you wouldn't want the first responders to be giving Covid to them, or worse having a situation where either the recipient is forced into a position of declining medical assistance or the firefighters reluctant to render it.

I actually agree with the mandatory vaccination policy in this case. 

Sorry Dan, but must disagree completely. To me, that way of thinking just feeds the narrative that everything that's happening and has happened is okay. All completely justified. 

I brought up firefighters because I think it's completely moronic to stop people doing a job that actually saves lives on a regular basis, purely because someone might have covid somewhere along the way. It's a ridiculous, scared and pathetic way to live. 

One of many questions I have is- Is covid the deadliest thing we as humans have ever had to face? Because if it's not, why have we suddenly turned the world upside down because of it?

Just to put it this way. Would you rather-

a. die in a mangled car wreck after five hours of agony because the person that could have saved you is sitting at home watching Tiger King because he's not allowed to work anymore?

or

b. risk catching covid from a first responder who, like any single other person you'll meet in the world that day - vaccinated or not - may have covid, and christ forbid, like 98% of people on the planet you may get a runny nose for a few days? 

Why is it okay now to all live our lives in eternal fear that anyone and everyone we ever encounter might have this overwhelmingly ineffective virus, when anyone who is scared of it should be vaccinated by now anyway? What have the last two years even been for? If you're in a car crash and not vaccinated then aren't you and the first responder in the same boat, and of the same mindset, and then whatever happens happens? And if you're in a crash and you're vaccinated who gives a cock's knuckle if your rescuer is vaccinated or not?

Again, apologies, just couldn't disagree more on this. 

For the record, I don't think anyone anywhere should be forced to be vaccinated. And that includes medical staff, police, firefighters... anyone, anywhere. I just don't believe it should be forced on anyone, and that's my belief. I am happy for everyone everywhere to have the choice to have it or not, but completely disagree with anyone being forced to take it for fear of losing a job and being unable to provide for their family. 

And there are plenty of medical experts saying now, that something like this Omnibus variant should actually be spread around, not stopped everywhere all the time. And fuck me sideways do I agree. Agreed with that mindset the moment the vulnerable were vaccinated, in fact. Whether it's Ominibus or the Cocksmacker variant, get the fucking thing out there and into everyone so we can all move the fuck on. Living the way we're currently "living" with it is only going to keep the world at this same level of fear for eternity. Let it be the next flu, let's all pass it around and resume the lives we once treasured. And for people who find that confronting, what's your alternate endgame? Live with masks and QR codes, shutting down anywhere a covid case pops up for the rest of our earthly lives? Because now that we're all vaccinated what other thing is there to wait for? We're living pathetic, scared, shitty lives and I don't understand why so many people are comfortable that this is now the new way we live from now on.   

[CureTheSane]

16 hours ago, auslander said:

Aw, so sorry to offend you with three magic words that seem to be a big trigger for you. I hope you never to listen to Public Enemy as you will break down and cry. No doubt your cop buddies won't be charging into crowds with batons protesting against fascist laws. If they do, "following orders, then they are responsible for their actions.

Ps. And if I need help in parenting from you, I will let you know.

Not triggered, surprised.
Heaps of people hate the cops.
They are all equally idiotic.

[auslander]

I don't understand why most people seem to be pro discrimination against the unvaccinated. The only people they put at risk are themselves or other unvaccinated people. Over 90% of the population is double dosed now, but meanwhile society and lawmakers are busy shunning those who aren't, including making them lose their jobs. Is it a spite thing? Getting revenge on those who question? It sure seems like it to me. I'm double vaxxed by the way and pro-vax. But, I am also pro choice about health and medical care. Actually I'm pro choice on everything that doesn't cause harm to others. That includes people who'd rather get covid than vaccinate themselves. Everyone who has wanted a vaccine could have done so by now so let's get rid of all these restrictions on our freedoms. 

[Metal T]

Because a lot of people need a punching bag and a scapegoat...people like this:

                   

[Dead Planet]

1 hour ago, auslander said:

I don't understand why most people seem to be pro discrimination against the unvaccinated. The only people they put at risk are themselves or other unvaccinated people. Over 90% of the population is double dosed now, but meanwhile society and lawmakers are busy shunning those who aren't, including making them lose their jobs. Is it a spite thing? Getting revenge on those who question? It sure seems like it to me. I'm double vaxxed by the way and pro-vax. But, I am also pro choice about health and medical care. Actually I'm pro choice on everything that doesn't cause harm to others. That includes people who'd rather get covid than vaccinate themselves. Everyone who has wanted a vaccine could have done so by now so let's get rid of all these restrictions on our freedoms. 

I actually agree with you for the most part. Unvaccinated people should be able to take their chances if that is what they wish. The only problem I have and I have mentioned it before, is that even with only 10-15% of people in a country unvaccinated, that 15% will get covid and will fill the hospitals and bring the health care system to its knees which then seriously affects all the fully vaccinated people who have other health issues....so while I believe in freedom of choice, their freedom to remain unvaccinated does have detrimental effects on others....

[AlphaMale]

How many people will be suing their governments when 5 to 7 years from now they find out the vax they got for covid-19 gave them terminal cancer or something else that will negatively impact their life.

I'm not anti-vax but I think these vax's came about way too quickly. I know more people online who were fully vaccinated and died anyway from covid then I do unvaccinated who got deathly sick or died from it.

I just wish this would go the fuck away. Last year at this time I was really ill from that bullshit. No more hospitals for a long time for me hopefully. 

Edited December 4, 2021 by AlphaMale

[tts42572]

1 hour ago, Dead Planet said:

I actually agree with you for the most part. Unvaccinated people should be able to take their chances if that is what they wish. The only problem I have and I have mentioned it before, is that even with only 10-15% of people in a country unvaccinated, that 15% will get covid and will fill the hospitals and bring the health care system to its knees which then seriously affects all the fully vaccinated people who have other health issues....so while I believe in freedom of choice, their freedom to remain unvaccinated does have detrimental effects on others....

This is the problem.  They end up getting sick, filling the hospitals and taking resources and care away from other people.

I personally know somebody that had a bad stomach pain recently.  They went to the ER near and sat in the waiting room for 12 hours before being seen and that was only because the pain had gotten so bad that they were demanding to be seen.  Turned out the person had appendicitis and it had ruptured while in the waiting room.  They were rushed into emergency surgery and almost died.....But did survive.

Basically that waiting time was the result of two things....The hospital packed with COVID cases and lack of staff due to them quitting because of vaccine mandates.  So the combination of people quitting their jobs because they don't want to get vaccinated combined with the rising COVID cases is just a bad combination.  And according to people I know that work in the medical field, they say the vast majority of people showing up at hospitals for COVID treatment are unvaccinated people.

I respect the right of people not to get vaccinated....I really do.  If you don't want to trust science and medicine and that's your belief, then great.  But if somebody is that strongly anti-vaccine/anti-science & medicine, then stay the heck out of the hospital if you come down with it.  Just let it run it's course and whatever happens, happens.  Don't go running to the Doctor to save you by using medicine and treatment when you never wanted it in the first place.

This thing is never going away on our current trajectory. 

[auslander]

The "filling up the hospitals" argument is a slippery slope. I read an economic futurist book that looked at that argument in detail. He predicted that in the future we will all be controlled by insurance, whether we can get it or not. Genetic screening, vaccine passports, lifestyle choices, etc. If we are truly so worried about our health system capability, how long until smokers cannot get healthcare? Or those who play contact sport (unless they pay gigantic health premiums)? Or those who have a predisposition to a genetic health condition, eg. heart disease? Etc etc. Perhaps our treatment of the covid unvaccinated is the precursor of things to come.

 

 

 

[auslander]

On a lighter note, this vision of covid in the future is hilarious 😂 

 

[CureTheSane]

What happened to herd immunity at 70 to 80%
We're at over 90% double jabbed now and this shit is still moving around at 1000 cases per day in my state.
Was herd immunity just a pipe dream?

[Dead Planet]

28 minutes ago, CureTheSane said:

What happened to herd immunity at 70 to 80%
We're at over 90% double jabbed now and this shit is still moving around at 1000 cases per day in my state.
Was herd immunity just a pipe dream?

Not sure how herd immunity was supposed to work but I guess with all the different variants around a lot of people are getting the damn virus more than once and plenty of people who have been fully vaccinated are getting the virus so the numbers that matter are how many of the 1000 cases a day end up in the emergency ward or the morgue....

[Geoff]

Yeah, I don't know either, but pretty sure herd immunity means tonnes more cases than 1000 per day, to the point where everyone gets it and it's impact is negated. Which in most cases it already has been... 

[tts42572]

On 12/4/2021 at 4:01 PM, auslander said:

The "filling up the hospitals" argument is a slippery slope. I read an economic futurist book that looked at that argument in detail. He predicted that in the future we will all be controlled by insurance, whether we can get it or not. Genetic screening, vaccine passports, lifestyle choices, etc. If we are truly so worried about our health system capability, how long until smokers cannot get healthcare? Or those who play contact sport (unless they pay gigantic health premiums)? Or those who have a predisposition to a genetic health condition, eg. heart disease? Etc etc. Perhaps our treatment of the covid unvaccinated is the precursor of things to come.

 

 

 

That's a good point I hadn't thought of.

Of course the hospitals are going to treat whoever comes in because it's the right thing to do.  Hospitals don't turn away people that make stupid choices.  I guess what I was saying above was really that it's just hypocritical for somebody who is unvaccinated, gets COVID and then heads to the hospital for treatment.  You didn't trust science and medicine enough to take the vaccine but now you want medicine and science to save you?  

Insurance is probably a whole different issue and yes, that's out of control in addition to the whole medical billing system.  Those are issues for another thread

[Leykis101]

The morons who go to the hospital are just as ridiculous as the people who rail on them for not being vaxed, maybe it's Darwin's theory and who are we to interfere? I begrudgingly went to the hospital, they told me I had Covid, to come to the hospital, I went in they checked my kidney function, gave me some strips to pee on every 7 days, if the strip turned red then to come straight in, then I went home, I think that's pretty common sense, when you make the decision to not get vaxed, don't you kind of assume the risk if it's real? they cant do anything for you, so whats the point in going there? everything they can do you can do at your house, I am firmly in favor of a waiver you need to sign if your not getting vaxed that waives the hospital of any of their duties to treat you, I always spout self accountability rhetoric, that's my olive branch to a vax that's about as trustworthy as the communists pushing it, in my opinion.

[AlphaMale]

18 minutes ago, Leykis101 said:

The morons who go to the hospital are just as ridiculous as the people who rail on them for not being vaxed, maybe it's Darwin's theory and who are we to interfere? I begrudgingly went to the hospital, they told me I had Covid, to come to the hospital, I went in they checked my kidney function, gave me some strips to pee on every 7 days, if the strip turned red then to come straight in, then I went home, I think that's pretty common sense, when you make the decision to not get vaxed, don't you kind of assume the risk if it's real? they cant do anything for you, so whats the point in going there? everything they can do you can do at your house, I am firmly in favor of a waiver you need to sign if your not getting vaxed that waives the hospital of any of their duties to treat you, I always spout self accountability rhetoric, that's my olive branch to a vax that's about as trustworthy as the communists pushing it, in my opinion.

Unless your beathing and lungs are so fucked up you have to be put on a ventilator. 

So sorry I inconvenienced hospital staff. 

[Metal T]

Still waiting for the  2 inch dick Chinese to be held responsible for giving the world the plague.POS Biden Admin and their pussy diplomatic boycott - forget the entire d@mn thing.Send NO athletes.

[Leykis101]

9 hours ago, AlphaMale said:

Unless your beathing and lungs are so fucked up you have to be put on a ventilator. 

So sorry I inconvenienced hospital staff. 

Your gonna make me do this aren't you? OK fine, well should've been vaxed, guess it serves ya right, you right wing Nazi piece of shit, why don't you go back to Hitler and check in, I knew your were fac, and your cis, all you fascists think your better then the law, it has to do with your cis gender, you cant help it, born in the coat of missing pigment your white supremacist privilege just eeks out,

[Geoff]

I come in genuine curiosity, but this hospital argument... I'd like clarification. So originally we couldn't do anything because covid was going to kill everyone on earth. Then there was a vaccine and we couldn't do anything until we all got vaccinated. Now we're all vaccinated and the sole reason left that we're still living piece of shit lives is because we don't want to overload the hospitals? Is this the correct read on it?

So, if this is true, we've resigned to the truth that is this is how the rest of our lives look? Masks, QR codes, crowd capacities, covid tests if we want to travel interstate, let alone international travel - then we need 87 tests and quarantine every time a new variant pops up, which will be fortnightly, or at the latest, monthly. This is it now, is it? Because if it's not, how does the end of it look? When will it be okay to live again without fear of clogging up the hospitals? 

I can only speak for Australia on this part of it, but all we've ever heard about is stopping the strain on the hospitals, but has anyone ever seen it? Would anyone even consider overloaded hospitals as an issue if the media hadn't told us it was an issue? I ask as anyone I know who works in healthcare, and to an extent, even myself, as a medical courier who has worked every single day of the last two years... no one I know, or I, have ever seen any single even remote sign of all this strain on our health system. So, like the rest of this pandemic, is it just another media beat up? All they've done for two years straight is belt fear into us, so is it unreasonable to think this is just another branch from that tree?

I'm just sick of daily excuses why our lives are still fucking horrible. Anytime the mere suggestion of return to a "normal" life gets brought up, there's a whole list of media-inspired reasons why we have to continue living in misery. 

Anyway, I think that was about it. I'm just in eternal wonder about why we all had to get vaccinated when it hasn't actually changed anything about how covid is viewed and feared. Covid is viewed exactly as it was two years ago. It still governs every aspect of how we live, so all these promises about getting vaccinated so we could go back to a normal life were obviously all bullshit. 

I was thinking about Australia's trajectory this morning. So if we keep up this pathetic excuse for an existence - the daily covid rate is around 1300 daily cases - let's call it 1500 daily cases if and when the other states open up. So if we continue on this trajectory, living in paralysed fear of the virus, acting like every case of covid is terminal cancer, we should get past this covid thing in about 15,333 days. So around 42 years. That, of course doesn't allow for population growth, but let's assume the cases go up with population growth proportionately. 

So that's the outlook in Australia. In 42 years, we might finally move on from covid, based on our current trajectory? What a future to look forward to! Oh, actually, that doesn't include cases prior to today, so maybe we can get out of this thing in closer to 41 years? Life just got a whole lot brighter right then.    

[auslander]

10 hours ago, AlphaMale said:

Unless your beathing and lungs are so fucked up you have to be put on a ventilator. 

So sorry I inconvenienced hospital staff. 

It's like how I apologise to the mechanics every time my car breaks down.

[heavyharmonies]

Geoff, this has been a Godsend opportunity for certain factions to implement the societal controls they've always lusted after, and they're using the opportunity to its fullest. 

[Dead Planet]

4 hours ago, Geoff said:

I come in genuine curiosity, but this hospital argument... I'd like clarification. So originally we couldn't do anything because covid was going to kill everyone on earth. Then there was a vaccine and we couldn't do anything until we all got vaccinated. Now we're all vaccinated and the sole reason left that we're still living piece of shit lives is because we don't want to overload the hospitals? Is this the correct read on it?

So, if this is true, we've resigned to the truth that is this is how the rest of our lives look? Masks, QR codes, crowd capacities, covid tests if we want to travel interstate, let alone international travel - then we need 87 tests and quarantine every time a new variant pops up, which will be fortnightly, or at the latest, monthly. This is it now, is it? Because if it's not, how does the end of it look? When will it be okay to live again without fear of clogging up the hospitals? 

I can only speak for Australia on this part of it, but all we've ever heard about is stopping the strain on the hospitals, but has anyone ever seen it? Would anyone even consider overloaded hospitals as an issue if the media hadn't told us it was an issue? I ask as anyone I know who works in healthcare, and to an extent, even myself, as a medical courier who has worked every single day of the last two years... no one I know, or I, have ever seen any single even remote sign of all this strain on our health system. So, like the rest of this pandemic, is it just another media beat up? All they've done for two years straight is belt fear into us, so is it unreasonable to think this is just another branch from that tree?

I'm just sick of daily excuses why our lives are still fucking horrible. Anytime the mere suggestion of return to a "normal" life gets brought up, there's a whole list of media-inspired reasons why we have to continue living in misery. 

Anyway, I think that was about it. I'm just in eternal wonder about why we all had to get vaccinated when it hasn't actually changed anything about how covid is viewed and feared. Covid is viewed exactly as it was two years ago. It still governs every aspect of how we live, so all these promises about getting vaccinated so we could go back to a normal life were obviously all bullshit. 

I was thinking about Australia's trajectory this morning. So if we keep up this pathetic excuse for an existence - the daily covid rate is around 1300 daily cases - let's call it 1500 daily cases if and when the other states open up. So if we continue on this trajectory, living in paralysed fear of the virus, acting like every case of covid is terminal cancer, we should get past this covid thing in about 15,333 days. So around 42 years. That, of course doesn't allow for population growth, but let's assume the cases go up with population growth proportionately. 

So that's the outlook in Australia. In 42 years, we might finally move on from covid, based on our current trajectory? What a future to look forward to! Oh, actually, that doesn't include cases prior to today, so maybe we can get out of this thing in closer to 41 years? Life just got a whole lot brighter right then.    

No issues with the health care system in Australia could be because you have been locked down for the last 2 years and haven't really had to deal with the same level of infection.....congrats, sounds like your politicians have it all under control 

[AlphaMale]

On 12/3/2021 at 2:54 PM, Metal T said:

         

Idiot just said this:

"If you have many, many, many more people with a less level of severity, that might kind of neutralize the positive effect of having less severity when you have so many more people," he explained. "And we're particularly worried about those who are in that unvaccinated class ... those are the most vulnerable ones when you have a virus that is extraordinarily effective in getting to people."